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JesseL

The Libertarian Party is the Party of Freedom

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The Libertarian Party just made this post on their Facebook page. I think they are the only hope for a peaceful solution to the overreaching government we have now.

 

"As Christian worshipers enjoyed Easter Sunday yesterday, many chose to pursue their faith out in public at Church, despite the difficult times we face as a nation due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

These Americans made a choice, an educated one. They understood the potential risk. Many Churches worked to accommodate the dangers faced today as best they could, attempting to keep worshipers separated six feet. Precautions were taken, and people freely chose to put themselves in difficult positions because their faith was important to them.

Unfortunately, in the state of Kentucky, Governor Andy Beshear instructed law enforcement to round up license plate numbers of churchgoers, with an intent to enforce mandatory quarantines and possibly more serious legal action.

At a time when Americans should be empowered to make the decisions as to what is essential in their lives during a crisis, this is not the proper role of government. We condemn any action meant to oppress a free people from practicing their faith."

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I agree it's the party that aligns with the freedom we love.  Just you wont get past the party die hard who think trump is god or Obama is god...

 

You cant find reason with them either just blinded by whatever news media told them to think.


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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10 minutes ago, Liberty Prime said:

Perhaps they are, but they fail to put forth a concise message that’s resonates with voters. 

 

Currently it seems they suffer from the same issues several ideas do. Grand ideas just not easily mapped out from where we are now  to their concept. 

 

I had high hopes they could get some solid thinkers in there ranks to really solidify things.

 

 

Voting hasn't worked nor will it.  The well is far to poisoned to change it.


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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Vermin Supreme is the front runner in the Libertarian Party right now. He is probably getting my vote this November.

 

 

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24 minutes ago, Liberty Prime said:

 

Well that’s one observation you could make but it’s not particularly a solution. 

 

Fascists, Communist, Tories, and AntiFederalists would agree with you but likely for different reasons. 😅

 

So why do you believe this, and what has voting failed to achieve?

 

 

Voting has failed to achieve getting anyone that's not a two party member in.  Voting has failed to get anything in that wont compromise on rights and you know for a fact a awesome constitutionalists will never win.    Plus you never will see term limits on anything either.  So you get the john McCain's and birds who sit in office getting rich selling you out.  The entire thing is a joke


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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1 hour ago, Liberty Prime said:

 

Well that’s one observation you could make but it’s not particularly a solution. 

 

Fascists, Communist, Tories, and AntiFederalists would agree with you but likely for different reasons. 😅

 

So why do you believe this, and what has voting failed to achieve?

 

 

Voting has failed to achieve getting anyone that's not a two party member in.  Voting has failed to get anything in that wont compromise on rights and you know for a fact a awesome constitutionalists will never win.    Plus you never will see term limits on anything either.  So you get the john McCain's and birds who sit in office getting rich selling you out.  The entire thing is a joke

 

 

 

Term limits prevent the careers of a polticans and the huge amount of money that goes to them.  It was never supposed to be a life time job with such huge benefits.    

 

Voting doesn't work anymore because the majority of people are just sheep who vote blindly to which ever party they are told to.  Nobody seems to care and they are to lazy to think for themselves. 

 

You do need a checks and balance on state issues.  We should have a electoral college in state events.  Currently small towns get destroyed the major cities in a state.   Again shows voting is pointless. Until that changes.

 

It needs to he completely torn down and rebuilt.  Their is far to much corruption in the elites who run this.  Nothing you can do will fix it.  It's been embedded for a century. 


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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1 hour ago, FloridaRifleman762 said:

Do you have a republican mode of government for your state that you are a proponent of to reach that goal?

 

Did you not understand I dont want political parties like we are forced Into.    Rather have no parties and very few laws and no taxes.


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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When I said republican, I was not referring to a political party. I made a assumption that you would be a commonwealthsman. 

 

To further clafiy, I mean republican as it is defined by Noah Webster’s 1828 American English Dictionary. And in reference to the United States Constitution Article 4, Section 4.

 

With that being said I do ask; Do you have a republican mode of government for your state that you are a proponent of to reach that goal?

 

The goal, in question, is the rebuilding of a liberal government like what was once had in America.

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19 minutes ago, FloridaRifleman762 said:

When I said republican, I was not referring to a political party. I made a assumption that you would be a commonwealthsman. 

 

To further clafiy, I mean republican as it is defined by Noah Webster’s 1828 American English Dictionary. And in reference to the United States Constitution Article 4, Section 4.

 

With that being said I do ask; Do you have a republican mode of government for your state that you are a proponent of to reach that goal?

 

The goal, in question, is the rebuilding of a liberal government like what was once had in America.

A republic  would be ideal.  However it needs to be restored and modified 


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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17 minutes ago, Megatron said:

A republic  would be ideal.  However it needs to be restored and modified 

The model is our original intent of the country 


“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn’t thinking.” – General George S. Patton

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Is it true that the Libertarian Party wants to auction off the National Parks?

 

If not, how do they justify their support for this form of socialism?


You can get a lot further in life with a kind word and a gun, than with a kind word alone.

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15 hours ago, Doug1943 said:

Is it true that the Libertarian Party wants to auction off the National Parks?

 

If not, how do they justify their support for this form of socialism?

 

No, as far as I know. Their solution might be something more like supporting the parks through entry fees and donations, rather than tax dollars.

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On 4/13/2020 at 11:10 AM, Thor said:

The Libertarian Party just made this post on their Facebook page. I think they are the only hope for a peaceful solution to the overreaching government we have now.

 

"As Christian worshipers enjoyed Easter Sunday yesterday, many chose to pursue their faith out in public at Church, despite the difficult times we face as a nation due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

These Americans made a choice, an educated one. They understood the potential risk. Many Churches worked to accommodate the dangers faced today as best they could, attempting to keep worshipers separated six feet. Precautions were taken, and people freely chose to put themselves in difficult positions because their faith was important to them.

Unfortunately, in the state of Kentucky, Governor Andy Beshear instructed law enforcement to round up license plate numbers of churchgoers, with an intent to enforce mandatory quarantines and possibly more serious legal action.

At a time when Americans should be empowered to make the decisions as to what is essential in their lives during a crisis, this is not the proper role of government. We condemn any action meant to oppress a free people from practicing their faith."

 

 

I agree with you.  A lifelong Republican agrees with you.  But you said, "I think they are the only hope for a peaceful solution to the overreaching government we have now."  But the problem, simply stated, is this:  "To be the only hope, they have to get elected."  The LIbertarian Party has spent decades wasting millions of dollars for candidates and ideas that will NEVER prevail.  There never was a stronger Libertarian than my now-deceased brother-in-law.  We spent many hours arguing this point.  Every time there was an election, he admitted to me that he voted for the Republican candidate.  Why would he do that?  (after all, he was the county chairman of the Libertarian Party).  The following was his reply:

 

"I didn't want to waste my vote."

 

The best thing that Libertarians could do is run as Republicans, like Senator Rand Paul.  Change will come from the inside, or not at all, Thor.

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2 hours ago, Thor said:

 

No, as far as I know. Their solution might be something more like supporting the parks through entry fees and donations, rather than tax dollars.

I seem to recall that they explicitly endorsed this a few years ago -- it's the logical implication of their beliefs -- but their current platform doesn't say anything explicit about it.

 

However, I think you're right: they would cut off all government funding to the National Parks.  They already charge visitors' fees, but these are not nearly enough to fund them. Therefore, they would end up 'going out of business', and would have to be sold to private owners.  I remember some Libertarians hoping that groups like the Sierra Fund could buy and operate them, but that avoids the question of: what if they cannot be maintained as public parks, in private ownership?

 

Libertarians are against forcing people to pay taxes for things they don't use. So of course they would have to be in favor of auctioning off the National Parks (as well as all the other land the Federal Government owns). 

 

Since this is not a very popular position, I think they avoid the subject. But it's the absolutely logical conclusion of the Libertarian viewpoint.

 

Which brings us to another point: Libertarians favor School Choice, and there I am absolutely with them.  But ... this means, people who have no children are forced to support the education costs of people who do have children. The money of people with no children is taken away, by force (which is what taxation  is) and given to people who have children.  How can Libertarians justify this?

 

And... how about the people who don't want to support the military?  Their money is taken away, by force, and given to the military, and this would -- I believe --- be true under a Libertarian government.

 

So ... Libertarians believe in taxation: in taking my money, by force, and giving it to enterprises, like schools and the USMC, that I might not choose to support financially.  I know they favor indirect taxation, not the income tax, but it's the same principle: people are forced to pay more for a product (via sales tax) than they would in a free exchange, so that their money can go to things like schools and machine guns, that Libertarians believe we must have, even if the Free Market wouldn't support them.

 

Now ... I believe the Libertarians are absolutely right to want to forcefully take people's money to support schools and machine guns (in the hands of our military).  But having admitted the principle that we, collectively, via the state must intervene in the market to force people to financially support some things ... surely Libertarians have admitted that pure Libertarianism is not adequate for maintaining a free society.

 

Which means that Libertarians are actually a wing of conservatism. We just differ on what things deserve to be supported by forcefully taking away the money of citizens via taxation.  We both agree on government funding of schools and aircraft carriers ... and then some of us extend that to National Parks and other desirable features of a civilized society.


You can get a lot further in life with a kind word and a gun, than with a kind word alone.

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1 hour ago, Headhunter said:

 

 

I agree with you.  A lifelong Republican agrees with you.  But you said, "I think they are the only hope for a peaceful solution to the overreaching government we have now."  But the problem, simply stated, is this:  "To be the only hope, they have to get elected."  The LIbertarian Party has spent decades wasting millions of dollars for candidates and ideas that will NEVER prevail.  There never was a stronger Libertarian than my now-deceased brother-in-law.  We spent many hours arguing this point.  Every time there was an election, he admitted to me that he voted for the Republican candidate.  Why would he do that?  (after all, he was the county chairman of the Libertarian Party).  The following was his reply:

 

"I didn't want to waste my vote."

 

The best thing that Libertarians could do is run as Republicans, like Senator Rand Paul.  Change will come from the inside, or not at all, Thor.

 

I have to disagree with you here. If everyone who thought they would be wasting their vote by voting Libertarian actually voted Libertarian, there would be far more Libertarians in office.

 

A vote for someone you believe in is never wasted. The only wasted vote is a vote for someone you voted for just to prevent another candidate from winning.

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1 hour ago, Thor said:

 

I have to disagree with you here. If everyone who thought they would be wasting their vote by voting Libertarian actually voted Libertarian, there would be far more Libertarians in office.

 

A vote for someone you believe in is never wasted. The only wasted vote is a vote for someone you voted for just to prevent another candidate from winning.

 

I understand what you are saying, and I fundamentally agree with it.  As of this moment, according to the Libertarian Party itself, in its mutli-decade existence, 232 Libertarians have been elected to public office.  Some of these people might not have actually been "elected", serving as Constables, Board Members, and so on.  As far as I know, Rand Paul has been elected to the highest office ever held by a Libertarian.  I don't dislike the Libertarian Party, or the people elected to office as a Libertarian.  I am a conservative, and have some arguments with various Libertarian beliefs.  But I consider Libertarians to be the next best thing to a conservative Republican.

 

Who knows?  As the number of conservatives shrinks in the GOP, the Libertarian Party might have a real chance.

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while I consider myself a constitutional libertarian, that may change to propertarian soon.

 

the "spectrum" of libertarians over recent years has increase. from socialist libertarians to anarchist (aka volunteerism). many pursue their form of liberty & at what cost. the party itself can rarely get along.

even if one could live in a libertarian society they the rules wouldn't be defined & heavily open to individual interpretation, not to mention the conservation of the commons would be lacking (at the least). while I sympathies with those that would preach liberty, too many disagree with the morals applied to freedom to get to that liberty.

 

propertarianism is the way to go, so that we may amend the constitution & slow (if not stop) the paracitism that has taken over this land.

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55 minutes ago, wquon said:

while I consider myself a constitutional libertarian, that may change to propertarian soon.

 

the "spectrum" of libertarians over recent years has increase. from socialist libertarians to anarchist (aka volunteerism). many pursue their form of liberty & at what cost. the party itself can rarely get along.

even if one could live in a libertarian society they the rules wouldn't be defined & heavily open to individual interpretation, not to mention the conservation of the commons would be lacking (at the least). while I sympathies with those that would preach liberty, too many disagree with the morals applied to freedom to get to that liberty.

 

propertarianism is the way to go, so that we may amend the constitution & slow (if not stop) the paracitism that has taken over this land.

 

A big HooRah here!  There are traitors in all parties.  The best thing to do is vote on a person's actual record or personal platform and see how it actually aligns with your personal ideals and beliefs.  Personally I tend to find that the higher a candidate is rated by GOA the more they tend to align with me on almost everything else.  I look at everything else but the 2A is the yardstick that makes the candidate a standout in the first place for me.  


"In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.” ― Mark Twain

 

"I prefer dangerous FREEDOM over peaceful SLAVERY" -Thomas Jefferson

 

"Si vis pacem para bellum" - Every wise warrior there ever was.

 

lfr.jpg.91d35fb0dbad2fa6e5cc5b2544ce55d5.jpg

 

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