Communication (HAM)

[Swampdonkey 8]

New to this site, glad to be here. Looking for some info on Ham radio set up and wondering if any one in New Mexico is set up.  Basicly looking for some equipment advice, what to bu and what not to, antana set ups ect. And who is on and how get get set up to talk with one enother.

[Dav Harzin 675]

1 hour ago, Swampdonkey said:

New to this site, glad to be here. Looking for some info on Ham radio set up and wondering if any one in New Mexico is set up.  Basicly looking for some equipment advice, what to bu and what not to, antana set ups ect. And who is on and how get get set up to talk with one enother.

I too am a newbie to ham  The beofeng radios are a cheap way to get started ,'get aftermarket ants with these' and when ya get better radios they make good backup comms.  high quality Name brands   ICOM  AND YAESU  ,

https://baofengtech.com/

 

https://www.yaesu.com/

https://www.icomamerica.com/en/

 

some ham sites that are staples in the ham community...

https://www.radioreference.com/

 

https://www.repeaterbook.com/

 

https://www.dummies.com/programming/ham-radio/ham-radio-for-dummies-cheat-sheet/

 

 

73 's   

[Swampdonkey 8]

I have about 10 beofengs, have built a repeater with them as well. Thanks for the links I will get to reading up on it soon. I got my hands on a 50 foot mast resently but ut just has a fiberglass  8 foot ish stick at the end. not sure that the correct antana for the ham set up. But I will read up on it and get started soon. If they take out cell and internet I want to be ready.

 

[Michael Tarver III 61]

If they take out cell and internet but the phone lines are still active, you can communicate PC to PC with an old school modem.

[Swampdonkey 8]

If cell goes out I'm sure they would cut the land lines as well. 

[Michael Tarver III 61]

I have a Baofeng UV5R+ and I’m still learning it. My dad has always been the HAM guy in our family but he lacks teaching skills. There’s a lot I don’t know or understand but I’m getting there slowly but surely. Thank God for YouTube.

[Guest O sleeper]

If any of you guys are interested, @ Trickshot has been organizing a way for militia groups nationally to communicate with each other and share information. He is in need of HAM operators, so if you are interested, please let him know.

[Guest Fed up]

If you guys go on arrl.com and just take the practice test you can take all the questions for each section at once, it's helping me a lot. They also have the review sections.

[no one 178]

Let me jump in and be the wet blanket here. First, getting your ham ticket does nothing for the other members of the group on ham frequencies. Each person must have their license to operate on the ham bands. That being said, a ham in the group is an invaluable asset as he will have learned HOW to communicate, how to erect antennas for a given coverage area, which frequencies are best, etc. I have heard a lot of people proclaim they will just get a ham radio and if the SHTF operate anyway. Well, they won't know how, and no one will communicate with them. So I commend you guys on getting your tickets and learning communications. You'll eventually look back and think "I really didn't know shit back then", because all of us do. I am also available to assist anyone, just holler.

 

Tempstar, Amateur Extra, VE

[MBR 224]

On 6/1/2020 at 8:08 AM, Swampdonkey said:

New to this site, glad to be here. Looking for some info on Ham radio set up and wondering if any one in New Mexico is set up.  Basicly looking for some equipment advice, what to bu and what not to, antana set ups ect. And who is on and how get get set up to talk with one enother.

In order to answer that question you will need to define what you want to do with Ham radio?

[MBR 224]

On 6/1/2020 at 9:58 AM, Swampdonkey said:

I have about 10 beofengs, have built a repeater with them as well. Thanks for the links I will get to reading up on it soon. I got my hands on a 50 foot mast resently but ut just has a fiberglass  8 foot ish stick at the end. not sure that the correct antana for the ham set up. But I will read up on it and get started soon. If they take out cell and internet I want to be ready.

 

I have found Beofengs to be crap radios, poor selectivity and very fragile. 

[MBR 224]

On 6/16/2020 at 1:57 AM, Michael Tarver III said:

If they take out cell and internet but the phone lines are still active, you can communicate PC to PC with an old school modem.

Sadly, if whoever they are, takes out cell sites, you can kiss POTS good bye as well.

 

Another problem is carriers have been given permission to turn down POTS as long as they provide another form of communications, AT&T for example is cutting people over to wireless and a version of VoIP which will not support dial-up modems.

 

A third problem is what is known as Subscriber Loop Carrier (SLC), these systems are extensions of the carriers Central Office (CO) switch to a Remote Terminal (RT) commonly backhauled by fiber, pre-ADSL we where having tons of complaints from subscribers of dial-up modems either not connecting or connecting at very low rates, what we discovered was Universal RT's that where fed by a CO RT known as a COT, would not support dial-up modems, this was because of the multiple digital to analog conversions, sub to RT (1), COT to switch port (2), and switch port to switch fabric (3), and 3 conversions just screwed up the timing to the point the modem would fail to work properly, Integrated SLC would work, maybe, this was because there was only a single D to A conversion, sub to RT and from there digital into the switch fabric.

 

The only real solution it to be able to have a radio system not utilizing a Ham repeater, (namy are unreliable) just a system that can run point to point simplex. 

 

For this there are only a few systems that will work properly, High Frequency (HF), which can have incredible range but requires bulky antennas which precludes practical handheld operations, the next step up is low VHF, 35 MHz to 50 MHz, the antennas are still long but there are handhelds that support low band and low band has some decent range, the next step up if VHF 150 MHz to 174 MHz still decent range and very useful range with handhelds, next step is UHF smaller antennas but shorter range.          

 

 

   

[MBR 224]

On 6/16/2020 at 9:41 AM, Swampdonkey said:

If cell goes out I'm sure they would cut the land lines as well. 

Cutting the lines is a tough thing to do, power failures are a huge problems, while cell switching offices have a lot of backup power the same cannot be said for cell sites, macro sites commonly have gensets but going further to mini sites and micro sites and landline remote terminals have limited backup power and that is where the chain gets weak.    

Edited June 24 by MBR

[no one 178]

Telephone centers do not have the huge battery banks they once did. Power outages will affect old fashioned telephone service in most areas now.

[MBR 224]

 

1 hour ago, Tempstar said:

Telephone centers do not have the huge battery banks they once did. Power outages will affect old fashioned telephone service in most areas now.

Most CO's still do, along with huge backup generators, the weakness is when the service is served outside of the CO.

 

Now we do have some maxi-huts that have huge amounts of backup power, but they primarily serve large business's parks.

 

 

 

Edited June 25 by MBR

[no one 178]

I was just in an AT&T facility in SC that used to have a whole floor of batteries, all gone. Guy said generators at substations are less maintenance.

[MBR 224]

53 minutes ago, Tempstar said:

I was just in an AT&T facility in SC that used to have a whole floor of batteries, all gone. Guy said generators at substations are less maintenance.

Well that's kinda of dumb, what's going to hold over the electronics between the time the power fails and the generator starts up and stabilizes?

[EricB1956 50]

General license ham here. Just got started last year, I can safely say that you really need a licence to maximize the full potential of amateur radio. 

[MBR 224]

55 minutes ago, EricB1956 said:

General license ham here. Just got started last year, I can safely say that you really need a licence to maximize the full potential of amateur radio. 

One needs a license to stay out of trouble with the FCC, plus most Hams will not communicate with a unlicensed person. 

 

That stated I believe a better choice for a Militia would be General Mobile Radio Service or Citizens Band Radio Service.

 

The best choice for a Militia would be to obtain a Private Carrier (PC) license on both VHF and UHF itinerant frequencies, all the Militia would need to do is pull a single license and all the members can operate under that license and unlike GMRS or CB, Militia members operating under a PC license can run up to 110 watts ERP versus the limited amount of power allowed under the other mentioned services.

 

I was granted  by the FCC a PC license with Area of Operations Statewide Florida, meaning my group or any other group I authorize to work under my license can go anywhere in Florida and have legal comms and if other Militias pulled the same type of license it would allow Militias to have interoperability with each other and do so legally avoiding any interactions with the FCC Enforcement Bureau.  

 

Should anyone have any questions about setting up such a system just contact me here and I will do what I can to get the job done.

 

https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/personal-radio-services-prs-keeping-touch 

 

 

Edited June 27 by MBR

[EricB1956 50]

20 minutes ago, MBR said:

One needs a license to stay out of trouble with the FCC, plus most Hams will not communicate with a unlicensed person. 

 

 

No, we won't. I got into amateur radio for two reasons, one, I wanted to learn more about grid down communications, and two, I wanted the ability to communicate long distances, as well as locally during a grid down situation.

 

That said, it's not for everybody, but I do believe that every militia should have at least two hams. Why two? Two is one and one is none. 

 

Having other means of communication is always desirable, you'd never want to limit yourself to just amateur radio.

[MBR 224]

9 minutes ago, EricB1956 said:

No, we won't. I got into amateur radio for two reasons, one, I wanted to learn more about grid down communications, and two, I wanted the ability to communicate long distances, as well as locally during a grid down situation.

 

That said, it's not for everybody, but I do believe that every militia should have at least two hams. Why two? Two is one and one is none. 

 

Having other means of communication is always desirable, you'd never want to limit yourself to just amateur radio.

Keep in mind using Amateur Radio to coordinate Militia activities is considered commercial use and a violation of FCC rules which could result in your license getting revoked and a fine issued.  And if everyone in the Militia is not licensed it for all intents and purposes precludes the use of handhelds for man to man communications.

Edited June 27 by MBR

[EricB1956 50]

4 minutes ago, MBR said:

Keep in mind using Amateur Radio to coordinate Militia activities is considered commercial use and a violation of FCC rules which could result in your license getting revoked and a fine issued.  And if everyone in the Militia is not licensed it for all intents and purposes precludes the use of handhelds for man to man communications.

 

I'm not talking about current times, I'm talking about after SHTF. 

 

Of course I know it's considered commercial use.

[MBR 224]

1 hour ago, EricB1956 said:

 

I'm not talking about current times, I'm talking about after SHTF. 

 

Of course I know it's considered commercial use.

Understood, but they will still need to train and that will require the use of communications and if not properly licensed might attract some unneeded attention, it's better to do it correctly from the get go. then to get nailed with a $5K fine and forfeit some rather expensive radio equipment.   

 

Another nice thing about utilizing a Common Carriers license is you can use dispatch and incident codes, and it's legal to use encryption as long as the call sign is transmitted in the clear, Hams are forbidden to use encryption.  

[Cb85 136]

Hams in the groups can use ham frequencies.

All Others can use MURS frequencies to send info to their hams, and then those hams can relay the info to other hams which then send it to different murs guys.

 

only one ham needed then in each group to get the info to all ppl. 

 

MURS maximum of 2 watts can use a detached antenna.  No license necessary 

Edited July 21 by Cb85

[MBR 224]

20 minutes ago, Cb85 said:

Hams in the groups can use ham frequencies.

All Others can use MURS frequencies to send info to their hams, and then those hams can relay the info to other hams which then send it to different murs guys.

 

only one ham needed then in each group to get the info to all ppl. 

 

MURS maximum of 2 watts can use a detached antenna.  No license necessary 

However keep in mind while MURS can be used for all operations Ham frequencies cannot be used for any form of commercial activity. 

 

Disaster relief communications legal for Ham frequencies, coordination of Militia operations probably not.

 

A Militia would be much better served with a Part 90 License that allows any form of legal for, or not for profit communications and output powers up to 110 watts is allowed, versus 2 watts which has very limited range.

 

Also Part 90 communications can be scrambled and or codes used, which is strictly forbidden on Ham frequencies.